Employee Retention Strategies That Are Not About Compensation

0:00 · Cold Open

Most leaders think employee retention is a compensation problem. My guest today, I'm going to assume is he's going to tell you it's not. It's a leadership problem. Or it's a dream problem. Or it's a calling problem. Ian Watts grew up on the east side of Detroit. He bought his first house at 19. By 26, he was a millionaire. By 30, he'd almost lost everything. The house, the business, members of his family, his health insurance, and very nearly his wife and unborn daughter. What he built from that wreckage is now one of the most compelling workforce transformation stories I've come across. He's the founder of SB Dream Coach, an employee success company. He has scaled HR systems from six locations to over 60.

Has trained leaders in over 30 industries across 40 states and four continents. And his personal mission is to build businesses that bless the world. And that is the reason that I asked him to be on the show today. Ian Watts, welcome to the Dream Dividend, my friend. Kevin, thank you so much for having me. It is a tremendous honor to join you. I'm excited to be here. Amen. So, I want to start where you started. East side of Detroit, family with a lot of personal and financial challenges. Take us back there. What did young Ian see growing up that made him believe business was the way out?

1:31 · Less Than $580 a Month - East Side Detroit

Well, allow me to start by maybe giving a little bit more color to what you've already shared in the opening. So, as you've mentioned, I was born and raised on the east side of Detroit. And in many ways, my story is somewhat familiar to a lot of boys and girls in particular minority boys and girls who grow up in urban areas. My father was in prison. My mother, my brother who's 4 years my senior and I we lived on welfare. We lived on actually less than $580 per month and what's really interesting is that when you grow up in urban areas you don't really realize necessarily that you're poor because most everyone else that you grow up around is in the same position. And so it just feels normal. There's a deep sense of normalcy there.

But once you start to get older and when your wanter starts to hurt because you begin to realize there are things that you would like and there things that you want and that you can't get. That's when it becomes illuminated that uh-oh wait a minute there is something that's bigger than where I am now and there's the possibility that life doesn't have to be this way. So as you can imagine I wanted to get as far and as fast away from that reality as possible and I saw entrepreneurship was a way out. Now obviously you know, there was illegal activity all around but because I felt always this deeper sense of purpose and that I felt that was destructive because drugs and alcohol have absolutely ravaged both sides of my family.

I saw entrepreneurship as a way out and I thought that at the time and you and I both know better, but at the time money was the answer to all of my challenges. So I didn't just see entrepreneurship as a way out. I wanted to be a great success and I wanted to get there by the age of 30. Well I didn't just want to get there. I actually wanted to become a millionaire and I achieved my goal by at age of 26. 26 and change actually, almost 4 years ahead of what I was shooting for. But, the bottom fell out of my very first business, but that was really instrumental for me because it was through that experience that I discovered my why. So, I'll pause there and allow you to just jump in with any questions that you have so that I can provide a little bit more color and context.

Yeah, I mean, I think we're eventually going to get through all of it. Um You know, the the You and I've spoken several times. The the addiction epidemic is real, right? I mean Very real. I'm I'm open, right? But, for those that have listened to my podcast, I'm a recovering alcoholic and drug addict. Um and it is Yeah, man, it's real. Like, I have a brother. You know, I mean, it's it's I don't know if there is any I don't know if there's a person who hasn't been touched by it in some way, whether it's a friend, family member, whatever. Absolutely. Yeah, it's just sad. So. Well, can I just share that I I applaud your openness because not only were you very open in sharing your story when we connected, which I was deeply appreciative of, but you shared it on your podcast. You let the world know >> Amen. that this is something that I am Well, let me say it this way. This is something that I am having victory over.

4:24 · The Mutual Vulnerability Moment

And people need to know it. People need to know it because you know one of the interesting things and I don't want to go off tangentially too far, but one of the interesting things about being in a storm is that you can't see straight, right? >> Yeah. Your field of vision is narrow. And when you're in the grips in the throes of addiction, it's hard to see anything other than what's right in front of you. So, to give people hope by sharing your story and sharing what life can look like on the other side of it is something I really, really commend. You know, my father, unfortunately, if I were to call him right now, it's 10:00 in the morning uh in Michigan. I'm Eastern Standard.

He's probably drinking, and I don't share that to take shots. I'm just saying it as a statement of fact, as a statement of reality. It's a very real challenge, and it has absolutely ravaged my family. So, thank you again. Yeah, man. Absolutely. So, we'll back up a little bit from 26. So, you bought your first house at 19. Yeah, man. >> 19. Yeah. 19. So, I'll tell you. Most 19 Most 19-year-olds can't figure out a lease. Like, so what was driving that? Was it Was it hunger, vision, fear, all three, something else? It was running from poverty. You know, it's been said that people who are really driven to succeed are often running from something or running to something. I was running from the pain of poverty, and I was running what I thought I was running to was happiness and fulfillment. And then you realize that money can't do that.

6:37 · First House at 19 - Running From Poverty

Stuff and things can't do that. But, that's something that you typically come to after you have ignored all of the cliches like money can't buy you happiness. It seems like despite the fact that that's been around for years, most of us say, "You know what? It can't buy me happiness." And money isn't Don't Don't get me wrong. It is very important. >> out. It makes things easier, but you it won't make you happy. Yeah, and most of us have to come to that conclusion on our own. But, here's how I got started. I somehow, and I wish I could remember, I have so many gaps in my memory.

I can't remember how I got a hold of it, but I actually got started with a Carlton Sheets home study course. Are you familiar with Carlton Sheets? Uh no. So, Carlton Sheets had a no money down real estate course, and when I was younger, he used to always have the infomercial on. And here's the scene. He's sitting on a balcony. He has khakis on that the creases look like razors. And he's talking to one of his students about how he's helped them achieve their goals and dreams and how this deal was worth 30,000 and this deal was worth 40,000 and how you can get into it with no money down. And I figured this is right up my alley because I don't have any money. Neither do my family or neither does my family.

So, I got a hold of that course at 16 and I studied it for almost 3 years and that's what actually helped me because what Carlton Sheets taught you to do is to think differently about how you approach real estate. If you can structure win-win scenarios, there's a way uh that you can often get into deals without having any money and that really worked out for me because, as I stated, I didn't have any. So, that's how I got started and I was running from the pain of poverty. Yeah, man. So, you ran pretty far and pretty fast, right? You hit it You hit a peak I said most entrepreneurs dream about, right?

>> Sure. Some something somewhere between 8 and 10,000 square-foot home in Oxford, Michigan. Sure. >> touched on millionaire by 26. And then, like you said, the bottom fell out. >> Yeah. >> Walk me Walk me through that season, the real estate crash. Oh my goodness. Well, let me tell you a little bit more about the house because it was the builder's dream house. So, the builder who built the entire community, it was in a golf community, so the backyard was a lake, the front yard may have been the ninth hole, if I'm not mistaken. I can't remember which hole. This house had things that were crazy that I didn't even know were a thing, like a doggy shower for the dog lovers among us in your crowd, and retractable chandeliers, remote fireplaces. It was an amazing home. It felt literally like a dream.

9:15 · The Dream House and the Wrong Wall

Yeah. But what was really interesting is that before I got to that point, I really began to realize that what I thought would bring happiness, it simply was not. Once I got beyond the survival mode, once I got to a point of stability, the thing that was really challenging is I started to really appreciate the fact that I had my ladder leaning against the wrong wall, so to speak. And so there were these longings and desires of my heart that I thought the success and money and stuff and things would fill, and it didn't. So I'll tell you, my wife and I jokingly say that '06 was a good year, but it was a traumatic year, and I recognize that that word is overused, and I'm only using it because a therapist told me that I was suffering from PTSD from that season well over a decade later, but we say that '06 was a good year because in the last quarter of 2006, I was on my first international mission trip in Uganda, Africa.

I was expecting to come back to financial easy street. Well, that didn't happen. Deal after deal, eventually the bottom fell completely out, and that was for a number of reasons, not the least of which is my business was too heavily dependent upon me, and it was most certainly too heavily dependent upon debt. And so what we were doing is what we had always done, and we were just looking to pull the money back out of deals that we had invested into. It was business as usual, so we thought. Now, I'll tell you, three quarters of the way through my first foray into entrepreneurship, the light bulb went off and I'm saying what I'm doing is not sustainable. I was doing what I learned how to do, which is deals. I didn't understand until later that there was a there's a bold and distinct difference between doing deals versus building a sustainable and scalable business. So, we took our liquidity, my wife and I, to open two adult foster care homes. Um we bought two half million dollar ish homes, maybe just shy of there, on the same street in a community called uh Palmer in Detroit. 17 217 201 Palmer. I'm sorry, Pontchartrain is the street. And we we were probably 95% of the way through building an adult foster care home, one of which was going to be owner operated. The other one we were going to build out for an owner operator. So, we had taken our liquidity and put it into these homes and we were just expecting and not just for those homes, but we had several others just to pull our money back out of there.

11:03 · 2006 - The Year It All Fell

But for a whole set of different reasons, the deals just started to fall apart. Now, this is around the time that things were crashing. The sky was beginning to fall from a real estate perspective. So, it got really, really difficult to get deals with significant financing done. So, I'm learning that though I'm expected to come back to over a half million dollars and pull our money back out or at least a portion thereof that we've invested, um that's not happening. Then, when I get back, we had six really close deaths in the family. And then my wife became uh ill with the birth of our first daughter and she could have lost her life and that of my daughters uh because she had major complications during pregnancy. And so, it was difficult. It really sucked. I remember and then I paused.

I remember my goodness, the bottom had fallen out and we lost our insurance, but now my wife is in her third trimester. And not only is she in her third trimester, but she has a difficult pregnancy. There was nothing like the sinking feeling that I felt walking into a scheduled appointment for my wife, and we were turned away because we no longer had insurance and we had a balance. I think my wife and I I wish I could ask her. She may have reached out to close to 30 people because no one wanted to take us. We didn't have insurance. So, even even if it wasn't a difficult pregnancy, just being in your third trimester alone, that's not very attractive. And then for it to get a difficult pregnancy and then to not have insurance, it was it was a tough season. I remember a number of nights where well, I I've had some dark nights in the soul. I remember a number of days where I just wanted to pull the cover over my head and not get out of it.

Yeah, man. Where you just feel like you want to crawl under a rock. Uh but thankfully, it was a season. And the beautiful thing about seasons is that they eventually come to an end. So, that was a bit about my experience in '06. Yeah. This too shall pass is what my mother would say. Absolutely, but when you're in the thick of it, it can't pass fast enough. It just cannot. Yeah. Um So, after the collapse, if I remember correctly, you and your wife end up moving into her father's home, right? >> We did. Rosedale? Yeah, we went to almost a 10,000 square foot home to a room in my father-in-law's house. And it was deeply humbling because a part of what I was running from was the disappointment of being dependent upon people who weren't there. So, the idea of having to be dependent upon another man when that was the very thing that I was running from, I didn't want to face what it felt like to have to need someone or want someone to be there for you and they were not. So, that was a a tough thing. Like, entrepreneurship is one of the greatest personal development tools known to man. It is a phenomenal context to stretch you in ways that most of us most of us intellectually we say we understand, but there is something so much different about what goes on intellectually versus experientially when you actually go through it. These stories of triumph and overcoming sound amazing when you're on the other end of it, but these are very real stories. Like, literally living that if I were to take too much time it literally may bring tears to my eyes cuz I just remember how painful it was, but we moved to my father-in-law's house and it was really helpful for me because it was a deeply humbling experience and it was also really therapeutic and healing for my wife and my father-in-law, their relationship. So, it turned out to be a wonderful thing.

15:40 · 10,000 Square Feet to a Single Room

Yeah, I mean, I would I would also imagine there was a pretty large dichotomy there for you, too, right? I mean you have to put aside your past, right? And put, like you just said put your faith into an adult man who you know, you've never had before, right? Like, you you didn't have it in your life. Um so you know I can I can just imagine the battle that you were going through inside like you know, well, this is really a kick in the you know what. However, this guy is this guy is here to support and love his daughter and me. Yeah. >> Um so, yeah, that's awesome. That's awesome.

>> Yeah, it was a blessing and just for the sake of transparency, my father wasn't locked up for the entire time when I was younger. He actually came home, I believe, you know, this is something I should know, but I don't spend a lot of time thinking about it. It was just before I was a preteen. So, and I would tell you for for a decent season, though I never felt a deep connection to him, he always felt like a stranger to me. For a decent season, things things got better, at least from a financial perspective, right? Because uh my father came home and he was a social worker.

Um it's it's really ironic that the very thing that he helped so many others overcome is the very issue that he's wrestling with. That's a separate conversation for a separate day. But now you got a two-household income, so things changed, but that's when I got really miserable. Um So, I'm with my father-in-law and I begin to see what a healthy relationship looks like, you know, between a father and a child. So, it was it was uh it was a a special season. And because of that season, our relationship is amazing. Now, my father-in-law is a special kind of type. He is He is you know, you know when people use that word interesting and it's always loaded? He has an interesting personality, hard worker, smart, really quirky, smart mouth, dry sense of humor. So, he's a real He's a real character. He's a real peach of a guy, but really a salt of the earth kind of guy. And it it like I said, it turned out to be one of the most amazing experiences uh of my life.

So, yes, it was most certainly an experience and highly developmental for me. Right. So, in our one of our first conversations, right, you said like the impetus behind just right, you and I were talking about like the Dream Manager stuff that I do. You said the impetus behind the small business dream coach was wanting to be what you didn't see is I think the words you used. Absolutely. >> So, to provide the coaching you never got. And And that's a powerful reframe of pain into purpose. When When did the clarity hit? Um like was it a specific moment or a slow build over time? Like what do we take me through that.

I think it was a slow build over time and it was preceded by or triggered by, I should say, disappointment. Because when I was younger I was looking for a mentors. I was hoping that I could have someone walk alongside me to to help me fulfill my goals and dreams. And for one reason or another, it just never really really worked out. I suppose if I were to put just a general bull's eye around what that experience was like for me I got a lot of motivational speeches. Right? Which Which I can appreciate. And obviously, having a whole lot of distance and a whole lot of space from it I may not have even necessarily have defined what I was looking for in mentorship as best or as well as I should have. Because if you haven't been mentored, that may be something that's intimidating, right? So, you know, these are things I didn't understand at the time. All I felt was a sense of rejection. So, after rejection after rejection after rejection, I resolved that you know what?

20:43 · I Decided To Be What I Didn't See

I'm going to get it anyway. I'm going to get to it, right? That's just my personality. So, this is not going to stop me, but I would it would be disingenuous if I didn't say that I was disappointed by it and it's because of that that I decided to be what I didn't see because I think that we're often most equipped to be able to minister to or serve others in the areas that we've overcome. I think often it's that pain that drives people as you mentioned to purpose and the pain of not having a mentor, not having someone who potentially could have help help me avoid such calamity from a business perspective. That was difficult. That was really really difficult and so that was the impetus for me starting SB Dream Coach which which is short for the Small Business Dream Coaching Company.

Yeah. So, good segue there. You touched on ministry. Let's talk about a merge for a little bit, right? You served in that role and led that for decade. Yeah, so I was in a number of different ministry roles. That was probably the role that I served in the longest. Emerge stood for Evangel Ministries Economic Restoration Group. So, it was one of the largest ministries in the church and it served people in the area fight Well, we did a host of different things. I won't run down the entire list of everything that particular ministry did inside of there. But Emerge for me served as one of the greatest personal development tools that I had experienced in my life. So, the first leadership development book I picked up was when I was around the age of 20. That was John Maxwell's 21 Irrefutable Laws of Leadership and he also had an accompanying course. And so, the pastor of that church at the time, name is Pastor Chris W. Brooks. He literally labored with me until Christ was formed in me. And what I loved about Pastor Chris and what I still love about him is that what discipleship looked like was not trying to create a replica of himself.

23:04 · EMERG and the Pastor Who Labored

He was laboring with people so that they can discover and demonstrate what God has uniquely called them or us to do. And for me, it became crystal clear that my ministry was business. And because the skill sets are similar, for many years most people thought that I would be a senior pastor. And I just didn't I just didn't And what Pastor Chris did for me by providing opportunities for me to be developed is to get crystal clear on what God would call me to do, which my mission is to build businesses to bless the world. So, my pulpit is a boardroom podium, so to speak. And so emerged, among other ministry seats that I served in, including eventually serving as an elder on the board, it was just a great developmental context.

Pastor Chris was so amazing cuz he would even allow new ministries to be created so that the people who oversaw those ministries could be developed, not just ultimately who would be served by that ministry. So, he was brilliant in that way. Right. So, how does how does that show up in the way you coach executives now? Did you get >> I think the the best way that this shows up in ministry, and in the kingdom we would call it discipleship. I think the parallel to that is leadership development, right? In ministry, you're laboring with people until Christ is formed in them, both their character, and helping them discover and demonstrate what they're called to do, and then developing people to that very end. So, it's not necessarily dissimilar in a business context. You want people to understand what it is that they're called to to You want to be really clear about what their personal goals and dreams are, and you want to create a context in which these people can do this. So, when you look at the Gallup 12, Gallup is the organization that is well-regarded because of their analysis of employee engagement. One of the questions that is typically posed in that Gallup 12 survey is, are you doing every day or do you have an opportunity every day to express what your unique gifts and skill sets are? Do you have the opportunity to do that daily? So, I think the parallel that you find between ministry for those, in my opinion, who do it right and great leaders is that they are helping people discover and demonstrate what they've been uniquely crafted to do.

They're very cognizant of what their goals and dreams are, and they're allowing them giving them projects, and they are providing specific development to that very end. Right. So, let's talk about what you've built, right? Like, so you have the employee success company, the AXE method, you guarantee executives you'll reduce turnover in 90 days or less. Not too dissimilar from the Dream Manager. Um, a bold promise, for sure, but like to the extent that you're comfortable, unpack the method for us. What does AXE stand for and how does it actually work? Sure. Sure. So, I'll tell you how it came about. The AXE method was developed based upon me reverse engineering things that I had been doing, but hadn't really quantified it. So, anyone who was ever under my employer employ or direct leadership, I wrestled with what is it that for me personally what is it that kept people from leaving? And what is it about me? What is it that I was doing that caused people to want to give me their absolute best? And it wasn't because I was so special. Right? It's because I helped them understand and appreciate how special they are >> They were.

>> and they were Yeah. to me. And so, I had to look at anecdotally what was I doing? And then after I did that, I looked up what does the data say about this methodology? And I said, "Wow, this is really impactful." So, the AX method, the A and the X is an acronym. The A stands for aspirations. So, if you want to significantly enhance not just engagement, performance, and retention, and the reality is the key or the entry point for higher performance to stretch their effort and keeping your people is engagement. So, the A stands for aspirations. Making sure you are very clear about what the unique goals and dreams are of your people, and not just what they are, how is it that you can support them in just that? And that's irrespective of what their current position is, right?

27:31 · The ACTS Method Unpacked

>> Yeah. Or even the position they may aspire to. So, the A stands for the aspirations of the goals the aspirations the goals and the dreams of your people. The C >> Got it. And I'll tell you this, I think the similarity between the Dream Manager and the AX method is helping people achieve their goals and dreams. If you just stopped right there, engagement is going to shoot through the roof. But I would tell you the reason that I went beyond just the goals and dreams or aspirations in the AX method, and the C stands for calling, helping people to discover and demonstrate their calling, is because most of us, some of us who have have these wonderful A-type personalities, but A-type personality or not, if you know what it's like to give your time, to give your effort, to give your energy to achieve a goal or a dream that you thought would give you this lasting or sustaining sense of joy and excitement or even fulfillment, we know what it's like to experience that disappointment. We opened by talking about all of the things that I thought would bring me joy, the money, the stuff, the things, and then you realize this isn't it.

And so, I think the reason that all of us feel like that is because we all have this void or this hole in our hearts, and the only thing that will help us is discovering and demonstrating what we're called to do. Now, obviously, because you and I share the same Christian worldview, this assumes that we have established a relationship with Jesus, but beyond that, John 17:4, Jesus said, "I have glorified you on Earth by completing the work or assignment that you've given me." So, we weren't just given this life to be saved and be in relationship with Jesus, we've been given the privilege to be able to participate in what God is doing in the Earth, and that means each and every one of us has a very unique calling. So, the reason that I moved beyond just goals and dreams to see this helping your people discover and demonstrate what they're uniquely called to do is because our heart pants for it.

We're all looking for this deeper sense of purpose or fulfillment and meaning. That's why, though we're doing the exact, we may approach it slightly differently, and the end goal is the same, transforming the lives of the people that we work with, that's why the act, I would say, I decided to go a bit beyond just the goals and dreams or what I believe the Dream Manager espouses, but the Dream Manager is absolutely amazing. And then T stands for transformation. We don't live our lives in a vacuum. Yeah. We live our lives in the context of a very real life. We live our lives knowing that we're going to have to suffer loss.

We have family members and friends who pass on. We live our lives and sometimes divorce is a part of it where it seems to rip your heart in two. We live our lives where sometimes our kids are sick and we're rendered what feels like sometimes completely powerless. So, the reality is this. And it's not just the bad things. We live our lives in the context of exciting things as well. For example, my uh youngest son is in sixth grade and his first track meet is tomorrow. Right? So, we live our lives in the context of a very real life and we don't check our humanity at the door. So, making sure that we can provide development, we can provide coaching that is transformative not just at work but at home as well is something that's really important. What I want to be able to do is to help people to say, "When I come to this job, not only are they helping me achieve my greatest goals and dreams, the things that make my heart pat, not only are they working with me to understand how I'm uniquely shaped so that I can do the things that I'm uniquely called to do, but when I go home, I'm a better husband.

When I go home, I am a better wife. When I go home, I'm loving and leading my kids better because of what's going on at this job." So, the T stands for transformation not just at work, not just professionally, but personally. And then the S stands for support. Now, many companies have this in employee assistance programs. The reason though that so many of them are not taken advantage of to the extent that they should be is because we don't have a coach that is deeply respected or leader that says, "You know what? Based upon what you're wrestling with, I think you should take advantage of this." So, the first three letters of the AX method are employee-centric. The S, the support, is building in structural or systematic support during the most critical times in your employees' lives. So, I think when you put all of that together, engagement shoots through the roof because you have the data already on just the Dream Manager alone. Gallup says that when employees feel that their leaders, that their employer cares about them individually, as a person, >> personally.

>> that they're more than a human doing, that they're actually a human being, they're 3.5 times more likely to be engaged. But, here's where the opportunity or the gap exists. When employees and when leaders make their employees feel that way, they're 3 and 1/2 times more likely to be engaged, but less than 30% of employees actually feel that their people care about them in that way. So, there's a great opportunity to fill in that gap. And when we do so, the reality is this. This is not motivational fluff. Engagement equals EBITDA. Because the higher engaged companies, especially as you look at what uh Gallup shows every single year, the more engaged the companies are, the more profitable they are, upwards of 20% more.

Mhm. At least. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. So, kind of touched on this a little bit, but you've said that what today's talent really wants isn't more money or perks. In your words, what is it and why are most leaders still throwing compensation at a problem that isn't compensation? >> Yeah, I'll start I'll start with the compensation piece. It's an easy measurable. It's I won't say it's a lazy approach. Some of it may be lazy. I think some of it is misinformed. But, here's what we know. And it provides a benefit, right? The golden handcuffs are very real. But, the reality is there's so many people have golden handcuffs that are doing just enough to not get fired. And that's not the discretionary in uh the discretionary effort that high engagement calls for. So, what we know is that salary and benefits bring people in, but it's culture that gets them to stay. It gets them to stay.

It's cliche, but it's true. You can buy a hand, but you have to win a heart. And I think what a lot of what a lot of leaders are disillusioned by and really disappointed about is that they end up doing stuff and things as opposed to making it part of their core DNA as as who they are. There's so many initiatives that fail because it's just that. It's an initiative. You haven't really built that into or woven it into the fabric of your actual culture. And so, I think many people are misinformed. And they'll say this about the next generation, right? They'll say that the next generation is entitled, but I don't think that the next generation is primarily entitled. I think they're exposed. Young leaders see that there more options. They see that there could be more transparency. They see what an amazing workplace can look like. And if I see it, it begins to build a desire. I want that. Right? So, I think that if employers really begin to embrace that people are simply more exposed and it's not enough, right, for people just to have high compensation and to have great benefits.

36:05 · Buy a Hand, Win a Heart

People want to feel seen, they want to feel valued, they want to feel developed, and they want to be supported. That's what's going to drive engagement and it can't just be some initiative, right? The reason these wonderful or not so wonderful initiatives fail is because it's not a core reflection of who they are, right? Yeah. Yeah, it's not it's not built into the culture. >> It's it's not built into the gimmick, essentially. It's a gimmick. >> It is. It is. I'm just trying to do stuff and things. I'm trying to throw I'm trying to throw band-aids on an issue that requires something that really requires you to get to the root.

That's that therein lies the rub. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Let's see. Where am I at here? So, You've just gotten really tall on me. I'm feeling intimidated. You just grown by about 5 in I moved I moved I moved closer. I don't want my head sliding too much. I'm not going to get that close. I'm going to lean back. Yeah. So, So, this is where your work and mine intersect, right? Like so, Trinity One's thesis, we'll call it, is what I refer to as like the human plus the machine equation, right? Like especially now with everybody afraid of AI and it it it it it it it it it it it >> And rightly so to some extent because, you know, this year alone, 50,000 jobs, 50,000 plus actually and counting.

Block, Oracle, you know, it it is it's something significant. Yeah. Um what that equation states is that AI when used properly should be used to optimize operations, right? And while the and the Dream Manager or the X method, those things optimize people. Where everybody goes wrong, I think or most people go wrong, they're doing one or the other. They're not doing both. My not so humble opinion is that both are required to really elevate that level of engagement that you're referring to, right? Like you know, it's it's like just something small. You know, you got a you have a worker who I just had this conversation with my brother yesterday.

He's got he's got a worker that you know, he he's uh you know, operations executive for produce distribution. So right, so he's got workers that are in coolers all day, right? They're freezing, leaned over whatever piece of equipment there, chopping things manually. And I'm like like Joe, like you know, there's machines for that. Like the person is still going to be there. But all that pain and and frustration can go away, like literally. Like you like that's an investment in business. And then while that's happening, if you then release another part of, you know, culture alignment is then you start like that in itself is a signal that says I care about you more than a person.

39:46 · The Human + Machine Equation

It's a nice byproduct that efficiency went up and output went up, but you're not going home taking pain pills or popping Tylenol through the day to get there. And that's that's I mean the line of business I I walk around a lot of factory floors and it is crazy how many people don't have industrial engineers that you know, look at this stuff like ergonomics and blah blah blah blah blah. So anyway, tangent. Sorry. So, you said your personal mission is to build businesses that bless the world. What does that look like when a company actually does it? How do you know when a business has crossed over from like what I just said, extracting value from people to actually investing in their wholeness?

I believe a business that blesses the world is one that produces results while improving the lives of the people that produce those results. It looks like employees growing in areas that extend well beyond their job description such as financial stability, family, health, personal purpose. What it looks like is and here's I'll even share my ultimate vision is that I would build a family office where I I plan to build this company for the next 10 years, an employee success company. Then I plan to have a liquidity event and I plan to infuse the culture that I build and employee success company into a family of companies that I will acquire.

And for me, I use business in many ways as a ministry context to serve people. Not just the customers, clients, or patients that we'll serve with the products and/or services that we offer, but the people who labor with you and for you for 8, 9, 10, 14 hours, 16 hours per day sometimes. And so, the same way that GE was known for pumping out leaders of great renown, I want to buy and develop a family of companies that are known for transforming the lives of the individuals that come and work for the companies. When we can build a company or family of companies of great renown where people are doing their level best to get their foot in the door and when they get their foot in the door, they never want to leave, I think that's what it will look like when the companies the family of companies that I operate or the team and I operate and that we build together is really on mission.

I mean, is there a future where major players have both a retention strategy and a dream strategy? You know, whether it's through X or through your major private >> most certainly hope so and I don't see them as mutually Me, too. Yeah, but I you know, outside of our self-interest because these are the businesses that we're building, I don't see them as mutually exclusive. Right? Like your retention strategy has to start with engagement. Because when you get this engagement thing right, it enhances performance to stretch your effort and retention soon follows. So, I see that they're one in the same to a huge extent. Yeah. I mean, what what is the typical first response that that you get when you walk in and say, "Hey, you know, to address your turnover problem, we're we're going to need to invest in your people's dreams." Like, what's the look that you typically get from a Well, I'll tell you this. So, I started evangelizing the methodology probably about two two and a half years ago.

43:58 · Businesses That Bless the World

And so, I'm just now uh making an intentional effort to install, for lack of better terms, this system into companies. I've been doing this by a lot of the executive coaching. So, the through line that I have in my journey is that I've been a business uh running a business coaching uh company for couple decades. And so, I focused on predominantly marketing and systems and innovation. And I've always undergirded what I've done with leadership development. And so, what I've always found working with people here locally and even internationally, even though what the focus is in the East is different than in the West, it's more team-oriented, it's about being a part of the whole, the through line that's pretty consistent is that people still want to have a deep sense of satisfaction with the work. They want to know that not just the work matters, that they matter as a person and what they contribute.

But, the responses that I've gotten have always been really positive because I can never get around the leadership challenges. But, it was always an oh, by the way. Right? So, even though we always we we often started in this place with started installing systems, like, and I think a lot of people get this wrong. You manage systems, but you lead people. Right? You can't treat people as if they are a program, and we program you just to do this because we all have lives, and we all have backgrounds, and we all have challenges, and we all have goals and dreams, and we all have different ways that we respond based upon the unique issues that they trigger us. So, the response is typically positive because people get it. And the reason that I decided to start up providing done-for-you services is because what I find is that most leaders HR leaders, CEOs, they're over well. So, one more thing is going to push them to the brink. That's why I love That's one of the things I really love about the Dream Managers. You're installing a person who is doing this for you to help infuse this inside of the company. I don't just like it because it extends capacity.

I also like it because there's also a deeper sense of trust because certain people are just not necessarily comfortable in trusting the things that are most precious to them to their leaders. Many of them have been put in positions for in burn personal performance. They haven't been trained on being a leader, and they may not necessarily have the heart that people trust yet. Uh hopefully that answers your question. Yeah. Yeah. So, if you get to sit down with 26-year-old Ian, you know, the one sitting in that huge spread in Oxford right before the fall, hm, what would you tell him? That's a great question, and it's not one I want to answer flippantly.

47:17 · Manage Systems, Lead People

Yeah, no. I would tell him a few things. One is you're going to make it because it was a really difficult journey even before the bottom had fallen out, trying to really reconcile why is it that I've gotten almost everything that I thought that I wanted and I'm still feeling this sense of brokenness. So, it's going to be all right. I would also tell him that you have to move beyond success to significance. Success being what you can achieve for you, significance being how I could use what I achieved to be a blessing to others. And I will also share this, that my greatest success is my succession.

Yeah. Those are the things that, at least at present, come to mind. Now, if you were to ask me a week from now, and I had more time to reflect on that, the answer may change. Now, I held I held that one back. Yeah, that's what that's what comes to that's what comes to mind right now. Yeah. Appreciate it. Appreciate the uh thought, the pause. We We close every episode with what we call the Dream Dividend. The return that shows up in your life when you invest in people, including yourself the way you were meant to. What's the dividend you're living right now, or the return on something you've invested in when you had zero proof it would pay off?

The greatest dividend, and this is one I can answer a bit faster. Um this is one I can answer a bit faster because the blessing in my life right now is having a deep sense of fulfillment that I am doing what I'm called to do, right? Because of our worldview, we know we're living for that day, not necessarily this one. And it's also a deep sense of fulfillment knowing that I could be used to play a small part in somebody's life being transformed. The greatest dividend for me, or greatest dividends for me, I would say, are those two things. Yep. Good. So, for the leader listening right now, the one whose best people are walking out the door, the one who knows something is broken but can't name it, what's the first move? Not the 90-day plan, like the first honest step.

The first honest step is simply being honest about where you are. You know, when you go to a mall and you're trying to find a store, before you can find it or before you can get to that store, you have to identify that little dot that says, "You are here." So, that you can plot out your path. We we have to get clear about ultimately, what do you want? Like, what's the destination? If you could wave a magic wand or paint a perfect picture of what you like for your company to be, what would that look like? Describe it. Right? Because that's what's going to get you excited and get you ready to take action because it was pain that probably caused you to reach out in the first place.

50:24 · A Letter to 26-Year-Old Ian

Excuse me. And pain is important. It is a wonderful driver. It's a signal. If we look at our emotions as signals that are telling us to act in one way or another, pain is a wonderful signal that says, "Hey, we need to do something different." But, you don't just want to be driven by trying to eliminate pain. You want to move toward passion. What is it that you ultimately want? This is your business or or is at least your department. It's your vision. Even within the context of a larger vision, if it's not your company, what do you want to see? And then we have to just assess, where are you now? And then we can build a bridge from where you are, ultimately, to where you want to be. We've heard this before in Seven Habits of Highly Effective People. You want to begin with the end in mind. So, what's the vision?

Even if it's fuzzy, even if it feels somewhat abstract, then let's put some real like markers in so that we know what life looks like when you've hit it. And let's build a bridge from where you are now and it's going to be painful. It's going to take time. But you can do it. Take courage. You can do it. Yeah, no doubt. All right. Well, I mean Ian, where where can people find you? How do people work with you? Book you to speak Sure. Sure. So, you can find me in two places. One, you could go to my website which is employeesuccesscompany.com. That's employeesuccesscompany.com. Or you can check me out on LinkedIn.

That's Ian Watts on LinkedIn. All right. Ladies and gentlemen, Ian Watts, founder of the Employee Success Company. A man who lost it all but then rebuilt it on a different foundation. And is now teaching leaders to build businesses that bless the world. My friend, thank you very much for being on the Dream Dividend. I appreciate it. Um and if everybody if if Ian's story stirred something in you today, if you're a leader watching your best people walk out the door, or you're an entrepreneur sitting in the rubble of something that didn't work, I want you to know any and want you to know you're not alone.

52:20 · The Dream Dividend

And you're not done. Right? Like you're never you're never finished um you're never finished until you don't get up. Right? Like you can be knocked down a million times. You just got to get up a million and one time. You know, the reason I built Trinity One Consulting and host this show is because I believe the same thing Ian believes. Businesses are meant to bless the world. I didn't Honestly, I didn't know that. Right? Like but when he and I talked, I was like, "Huh, like I like that. I'm going to take that." Um and and and the people the people inside them are meant to become who they were created to be, right? They're they're they're not there to be a machine operator or a production planner or a buyer or a marketing uh uh you know, agent, like nothing like that.

So, if you're scaling business and the chaos is starting to win, which never happens, if your systems can't keep up with your ambition, that's what we do at Trinity One Consulting, fractional COO and integrator work, AI optimization through Trinity Calibrate, and full business launches through Trinity Forge. And on the people side, because that's what this show is mainly about, because Ian has just reminded us the people side is everything. I serve organizations as a certified Dream Manager. We bring the Dream Manager methodology directly into your team to unlock engagement, loyalty, and the kind of culture great employees never want to leave. You can find us at Trinity One Consulting.

Now time for the for the promo. If this episode hit you, do me a favor, please don't keep it to yourself. Share it with one leader who needs to hear it. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and leave a rating if you've got 30 seconds. That's how this message gets out. That's how this show grows, and that's how more leaders find their way to the kind of transformation that Ian and I are talking about. Um and before I close, I need to honor the source of the work, which is the Dream Manager methodology. It was created by a gentleman named Matthew Kelly. And if what you've heard today moves you, if you want to go to the source, read the book.

55:33 · Connect With Ian

It's called The Dream Manager. Especially if being a certified Dream Manager is something you want to know more about, go to floydconsulting.com. Matthew, Kate Bohman, the CEO, and the entire Floyd team have built something that's quietly transforming companies all over the world. So, I give credit where credit is due. And you should go learn from the best. Now, I'm not saying the best is Matthew or Ian, cuz they're both brilliant guys, but you pick. Just learn from somebody, right? We don't know it all. So, until next time, guys. Keep building, keep dreaming, and remember, the dividend on the dream is always bigger than the cost of chasing it.

I'm Kevin Patrick, and this is The Dream Dividend.